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belegkano »» models Re: Evo, vs crea,   posted: 11-Jun-03 01:32   »»  What is a valid argument? just curious?:)

rockingbacchus »» models Re: Evo, vs crea,   posted: 11-Jun-03 03:16   »»  hmmm... ok your counter arguments to my arguments made no snese to me at all.... can exyone explain what hes talking about? sorry... i have trouble dechipering misspellings... strange bacause i make so many....

neoaetas »» models »» homepage Re: Evo, vs crea,   posted: 12-Jun-03 23:35   »»  >And if the earth was 4 billion yrs. old why is oldest tree only 6,000 yrs. old? The oldest tree is 6,000 years old because that may be the threshhold of tree life. >What killed ALL the older trees? Old age. nothing can live forever. besides, long-living trees evolved, so they can't have been around forever. >Why can’t anyone produce a skeleton of a human older than 8,000 yrs.? Because pure humans (homo sapiens) probably evolved within the last 8,000 years. >Who invented laughter? Why must everything be invented? besides, humans "invented" laughter. >Who invented jokes? Humans, retard. >Why do electrons orbit protons? What keeps them together? Electrical charge keeps them together, much the way in which hair will "stick" to a balloon if they hae been rubbed together. >Why are seashells found on all the highest mountains? What put them there? The Earth's tectonic plates have moved, porducing mountains in places where oceans were. New York state used to be joined with Europe and the Appalachians were the highest mountains in the world. >And who invented God? Humans, out of a need to think that there was life after death and that there were other sentient beings out there. Specifically and historically, Jews invented one god, it is called monotheism. Before that, multiple gods controlled everything and began the reath. God changes as people change.

belegkano »» models Re: Evo, vs crea,   posted: 13-Jun-03 12:35   »»  You forget humans evolved from monkeys, they don’t believe in a god of any kind, just trees, fruit, and other animals. And if tectonic plates have moved, wouldn’t disrupt your fossil layers, I know the earth is made up of plates, so don’t explain the Pangia theory to me, Why do we have morals, hatred and love, Love is truly a taking to another, to care for another. Monkeys don’t love, they mate how did humans invent humor? Under what circumstances? If animals don’t laugh, why do we? Bk

rockingbacchus »» models Re: Evo, vs crea,   posted: 14-Jun-03 21:40   »»  Well, did humans nessecarily make humor? We hove no evidence that our "animal friends" dont laugh, cry, love, have morals, or many other "human-like" qualities. Oh, and the reason we humans have audlible laughter is the constrcution of our voice boxes, mouths, and tounges. Animals may have laughter that we dont appreciate or interpret the same way.

neoaetas »» models »» homepage Re: Evo, vs crea,   posted: 15-Jun-03 12:55   »»  Another reason, beleg, is that humans have vastly more complex cerebral structures than most animals. Humans have fun because our brains have the capacity to. Take into account other animals that seem to have fun, even one species you mentioned. Dolphins have about 3 times (or about that) more wrinkles in their brains than we do, and, as you said, they seem to have fun a lot. Monkeys and other apes have fun and play with eachother. We all have similar brain structures. What you should seriously do is read the Origin of Species Through Natural Selection Or The Preservation of Favoured Races In The Struggle of Life (Full Title). Weigh how much evidence there was towards evolution even back in the 1800's versus how much evidence in the Bible of Creation (one chapter). Darwin gives examples from the Galapagos Islands, domestic animals, and many other sources. Nowhere in the chapter on objections to his theory does he even consider the Bible as a source of evidence against it. And no, Darwin did not "invent" evolution. Hundreds of other naturalists before him and after him formulated the overall theory, he just hypothesized NATURAL SELECTION. To the beginning of your post: No, they don't believe in God (as far as we know). The reason people believe in God is the same reason we believe in aliens, the need to think that there are other like us out there somewhere. Monkeys aren't sentient, all they really need to believe in is other animals and there are plenty out there. Tectonic plates did disturb fossils. Obviously you have never seen upturned fossil layers. Tectonic plate disturbances of fossils caused the sea creature fossils on mountain tops that you were so adamant about. Here's a tip: Take Earth Science in high school like I did, it explains a lot. How do we know animals don't love? Dogs and cats obviously do. And get it into your head, humans DID NOT invent humor! Actually, it evolved. Eventually, through time, humans learned to laugh and joke in order to feel better and relate to others. Does the Bible tell how humor originated? Then obviously you can't rely on it that much if humor is that important. It is spelled YOU, NOT "U". Please refrain from using i.m. slang. You did say you would stop.

neoaetas »» models »» homepage Re: Evo, vs crea,   posted: 19-Jun-03 21:09   »»  well, this thread is dying

Heavenlywarrior »» models Evo, vs crea,   posted: 26-Aug-03 18:07   »»  Well, I'm not gonna be on here for long. There is really no question about this. I know all about evolution. I've been brought up learning it but I don't believe a word of it. There is far too much evidence AGAINST it. Since I know all about your side of the story, I'd like you to read about mine. It's only fair. http://emporium.turnpike.net/C/cs/index.htm is the link to the page that I would like you all to read. It's very interesting and I'd love for you all to take a look. I probably won't post on here anymore so have fun you guys. God bless!

neoaetas »» models »» homepage Re: Evo, vs crea,   posted: 26-Aug-03 18:35   »»  well, this really isn't about evolution vs creationism, it was started about the bible's version of how life began (god creates universe; all animals from genesis survive unchanged today) vs the idea that life might have evolved over time, with some species evolving into others. the beginning of this thread was in another (Karl Sims thread) where beleg states that he absolutely does not believe in evolution. In this thread, he goes on to show blind faith in the bible and doesn't seem to listen to any evidence to the contrary. In addition, he puts forth no good evidence of his own. I haven't read your link yet, but i think that people might be more persuaded to argue for or against any case if solid evidence is presented for both sides. As for me, i don't believe in evolution in the early history of earth. I think that there was a moment when there was no life, and a moment where there was. however, as i read the beginning of your link, it seems like the author thinks that life could not have possibly started without extranatural intervention. This seems like saying that when sugar molecules are together in great enough numbers and some are in the proper order, they will not form a crystal on their own, but by god(allah, brahman, etc)'s help. That i don't believe. -N.A. P.S.-hope i got that sugar property right

evilgoatfiend »» models Re: Evo, vs crea,   posted: 26-Aug-03 21:06   »»  I just realized this thread is created but let me tell you some things that I noticed. There is a middle ground (where I aproximately stand) that believes in both. Scientific facts cannot be denied, and nothing makes me more sick than someone in denial warping the truth in God. And the universe wasn't created in 7 days. However what the Bible says is true. How is God to explain to these people who have so little technology that they can't comprehend the units of time that really existed so he explained to them in 7 phases of creation. In addition some versions of the Bible say that he molded Adam from the clay of the Earth. molded. That means slowly formed giving more and more detail and complexity. Exactly how Darwin describes. The fact that the Bible came first and insinuated that is almost proof to it's credability not the other way around. There are some phases of evolution that scientists say can't be explained by Darwin's theory. Maybe only by divine intervention. Try this on for size, at the time the Bible came out. People saw volcanoes and called it hel.l, and saw lunatics and said they were demonically possessed. A lot of the Bible has come out exactly how people assumed it, the rest is just a question of faith, like th Bible says...

AlanGordon »» models Re: Evo, vs crea,   posted: 27-Aug-03 16:10   »»  Look at the sodarace project. We create models, AI evolves models. I vote that we conclude the great question of Evolution vs. Creationism by seeimng which one creates faster models... But seriously folks. You've got to face it eventually: Both of you are convinced that the other is wrong, and nothing's going to change that. This argument never concludes.

neoaetas »» models »» homepage Re: Evo, vs crea,   posted: 28-Aug-03 15:32   »»  indeed, but what is that purpose of having a debate unless you are serious enough about your view to not forsake it for another? There's my philosophy of the day :) -N.A.

AlanGordon »» models Re: Evo, vs crea,   posted: 28-Aug-03 16:01   »»  True, but in most meaningful debates, you are at least open to listen to the other side, without automatically transforming anything they say into "This is meaningless religious/evolutionist hogwash!"

neoaetas »» models »» homepage Re: Evo, vs crea,   posted: 29-Aug-03 21:04   »»  i would listen to religious hogwash if it didn't come in the form of "Why do electrons orbit protons? What keeps them together". An idiotic statement requires an idiotic response. -N.A.

evilgoatfiend »» models Re: Evo, vs crea,   posted: 30-Aug-03 14:02   »»  The bible says so, is not a ligetimate arguement because it is based on belief. I perfer a discussion behind the creditibity of the Bible. How a religous system fits in with a scientifoic system. It is my belief that since religion is based on belief and science on fact, it is science that is true, religion is true only if it fits in with science. I believe that there is a unity, but there is nothing I hate more than a Chrisitian who hides behind "the Bible says so", because it makes all us look like a bunch of irrational dilusionals who broke out of the crazy bin and are spreading Chrisitianity like a disease. It is not like that! There is a coexistance without the compromise from either! Since the glory of the Bible is not something that can be expressed in word, trying too is fruitless. So if this debate continues I will be on the Evo side because I know Christianity won't deny their God, and go on to believe both.

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